We who preach the gospel must not think of ourselves as public relations agents sent to establish good will between Christ and the world. We must not imagine ourselves commissioned to make Christ acceptable to big business, the press, the world of sports or modern education. We are not diplomats but prophets, and our message is not a compromise but an ultimatum. A.W. Tozer
Therefore let God-inspired Scripture decide between us; and on whichever side be found doctrines in harmony with the word of God, in favor of that side will be cast the vote of truth. --Basil of Caesarea
Once you learn to discern, there's no going back. You will begin to spot the lie everywhere it appears.

I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who has strengthened me, because He considered me faithful, putting me into service. 1 Timothy 1:12

Thursday, July 27, 2017

Questions, for Catholics, About Purgatory


1. Hebrews 9:27 says that after death we face judgment, not purging.  How do reconcile this with purgatory?

2. Hebrews 1:3 and 2 Peter 1:9 say Christ already "purged" our sins (KJV - others say "provided purification" and the Catholic Bible says “cleansed.”).  So if Christ already "purged" (or cleansed) our sins, what is purgatory for? 

3. 1 John 2:2 says Christ is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, as does Romans 3:23-25.  If our sins have been atoned for, what is the purpose of purgatory? 

4. If purgatory is necessary, does that not say that Christ was ineffective in his atonement in that it didn't pay for all sin? (This is also a good question about the Mass - if Christ already paid for our sins by the one sacrifice, then why is the sacrifice of the Mass necessary? (Hebrews 10:18 - and actually read the whole chapter up to that point!) 

5. How does one know if they have spent long time enough in purgatory? When buying indulgences, how does one know when enough has been paid to release them from purgatory? 

6. Why is it that purgatory didn't become part of the doctrine of the Church until 1438 if it was a true biblical position? 

7. Does the "gospel" sound like "good news" if you can attend thousands of Masses throughout your life and still not die fully purified from sin? 

8. Since Philippians 1:23 and 2 Corinthians 5:8 say Christians go immediately to be with the Lord (as also the thief on the Cross), how does this reconcile with purgatory? 

8 comments:

Anonymous said...

This is EXCELLENT!

-Carolyn

Doug Evans said...

Purgatory is a man-made construct based on... well I honestly can't find anything that it can be based upon other than the desire to fill the church coffers with income from selling indulgences.

The RCC claims that postmortem forgiveness is found in 1 Corinthians 3:11–15, Matthew 5:25–26, and Matthew 12:31–32 and, of course, none of those passages have anything to do with the concept. They also fall back on their own invention, 2 Maccabees 12:41-45, which is a story about taking up a cash collection as a sin offering, which probably delighted the papistry.

Then, to add insult to God's word, the RCC falls back on even more non-canon fiction: Acts of Paul and Thecla [A.D. 160], Epitaph of Abercius [A.D. 190], and The Martyrdom of Perpetua and Felicity 2:3–4 [A.D. 202]

Yes, early church fathers did speak of temporal punishments, such as Augustine:

"That there should be some fire even after this life is not incredible, and it can be inquired into and either be discovered or left hidden whether some of the faithful may be saved, some more slowly and some more quickly in the greater or lesser degree in which they loved the good things that perish, through a certain purgatorial fire" (Handbook on Faith, Hope, and Charity 18:69 [A.D. 421]).

But clearly this is unbiblical speculation where each comma can properly be followed by the word "maybe" due to the lack on any biblical reference

Glenn E. Chatfield said...

Yep, and I address purgatory in this article:
https://watchmansbagpipes.blogspot.com/2010/06/unbiblical-catholic-sin-purgatory-and.html

But I just thought these to be thought-provoking questions :oD

Jesse said...

Hi Glenn,

Decent material, as usual.

Be sure to check out my complete refutation of Roman Catholic Purgatory:
https://rationalchristiandiscernment.blogspot.com/2017/02/biblical-refutation-of-purgatory.html

And Roman Catholic sources that ADMIT to Purgatory being UNBIBLICAL:
https://rationalchristiandiscernment.blogspot.com/2017/04/interesting-roman-catholic-quotes-on.html

Diego Dave said...

pretty sure you are correct about purgatory. but what was point then of praying for dead in 2 maccabees 12:46?

Martha said...

You are spot on Glen. This is another words based theology, purgatory, denying the true "work" of Jesus on that tree at Calvary.

There is a convergence between the Catholic and Lutheran religions in our area and a "purging" of Jesus out of the church. Speak of Jesus and His Wonderful Truths you are learning from our Bibles, and these people think you're a "nut," but speak gossip, slander and lies, and church folks love you, love bomb you, and speak highly of you because you are one of them.

The greatest ministry is amongst us, here, in the United States of America.

Martha said...

Oh yes, and I forgot to mention, false doctrines always require mammon/money/payment of some sort on behalf of the lower laity as deemed in the hearts of wolves in sheep's clothing. Where you find a constant reminder of money, money, money, in religious systems, you shall find wicked and evil hearts at the end of the money trail.

Love giving to the needy, the poor, and the struggling apart from religious systems to those who are humbled and "in need." They don't have the financial resources to buy big sound systems accompanied with all of the latest instruments to "worship," they need the mammon to survive and live in this world.

Martha

Glenn E. Chatfield said...

Maccabees is not in the Canon of Scripture.

Even so, just because some people do thing, that doesn't make them proper doctrine or even of God.