We who preach the gospel must not think of ourselves as public relations agents sent to establish good will between Christ and the world. We must not imagine ourselves commissioned to make Christ acceptable to big business, the press, the world of sports or modern education. We are not diplomats but prophets, and our message is not a compromise but an ultimatum. A.W. Tozer
Therefore let God-inspired Scripture decide between us; and on whichever side be found doctrines in harmony with the word of God, in favor of that side will be cast the vote of truth. --Basil of Caesarea
Once you learn to discern, there's no going back. You will begin to spot the lie everywhere it appears.

I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who has strengthened me, because He considered me faithful, putting me into service. 1 Timothy 1:12

Tuesday, February 3, 2026

Is This Your Church?


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6 comments:

Craig said...

No. But on some level, I don't object to churches using different methods to engage different groups, as long as the central message remains True to The Gospel. Obviously some old white guys leading a Hip Hop Jam is going to come off as ridiculous, but I can see having it as an option providing that it doesn't water down The Gospel.

As long as a church has focused services dedicated to worshiping and focusing on YHWH, I think that adding other expressions of worship or evangelism aren't necessarily a bad thing. As long as they don't become idols or take the focus off of YHWH.

February 4, 2026 at 9:08 AM
Glenn E. Chatfield said...

Hi Craig,
Well let’s look at them line by line.
1.Seniors Gospel Hour, just fine.
2.Gregorian Chant liturgy. Has no place outside the Papist church.
3.Contemporary Suburban Worship. That can mean just about anything; in my experience its mostly seeker-sensitive or market-driven
4. Hip hop is incongruent with worship, IMO.
5. X-treme youth service. Again appealing to the crowd, and not really focused on the Gospel.
6. Mystic journey…. Total nonsense, often blending into the occult.
7. Holy Spirit free stye—i.e. charismania, which is self-focussed.
8. The weekly message is from rank heretic Joel Osteen’s ilk.

“Focussed” services are for people who think church is all about them personally.

February 4, 2026 at 4:52 PM
Craig said...

Well, I guess you kind of missed my larger point, but I'll play along.

1. If "focused" services are a problem, then this is a problem.
2. That's certainly your opinion.
3. Again, you're imposing your "experience" on something undefined. But that's ok.
4. "IMO" says it all. Call me crazy, but wouldn't "worship music" be primarily defined by lyrical content as opposed to musical style? What other genres would you ban from "worship music"?
5. Again, you are making an assumption based on facts not in evidence.
6. Possibly, but not definitively.
7. I'd argue that any instance where the Holy Spirit is moving and active cannot be "self focused" by definition. Yet, the charismatics have a long history of self focus.
8. The message title (as does the whole thing) seems satirical, or hyperbolic, sarcastic.

But, let's look at what I really said, and note that I did not endorse the specific examples in the meme.

"I don't object to churches using different methods to engage different groups as long as the central message remains True to The Gospel."

As remaining "True to The Gospel" would seem to be the underlying premise, anything else is style not substance.

My second point seems self evident, and seems as though restating or quoting it would be redundant.

I'm confused as to how adding groups based on shared characteristics (focused on The Gospel and in line with the broader church) is such a problem. If one of the events in the meme diverted from my focused on "The Gospel" basis, then they'd be a problem based on that alone, not based on style.

February 5, 2026 at 10:05 AM
Glenn E. Chatfield said...

Hi Craig,
Firstly, everything in my list is my opinion; I never intended it to sound like I was expressing facts. I would like to clarify my beliefs a wee bit better

For #1 I was thinking it was more of an hour where seniors studied the Gospel but now looking again, you are correct. However, it may be a good idea for special service for senior due to many issue, such as hearing, trying to get wheelchairs in proper positions for listening, etc.

#2: "Gregorian chant is the central tradition of Western plainchant, a form of monophonic, unaccompanied sacred song in Latin of the Roman Catholic Church." So I would really think this should be a problem outside of a papist church.

#3; We've visited many churches in this area while seeking a fundamental worship, and what I noted above is what we encountered.

#4 Here's what I mean regarding music being congruent with worship, with the lyrics. Here's a comment I made on a post back in 2010:
I’m a firm believer that music should be congruent with the lyrics. For example, one certainly wouldn’t write lyrics for a love song and then put it to a Sousa march, nor would a military fighting song be put to a slow waltz. The traditional music for Amazing Grace reflects the testimony and praise behind the words. Grace Like Rain has music which is dirge-like, without any real melody, as if the singer isn’t very thrilled with the testimony - until the chorus of course. Can you imaging anyone asking for this version to be played at a funeral or other memorial ceremony?
I can't see Hip-Hop as being congruent with worshiping the Lord.

#5. Again, we have churches around here focussed on teens and college students (University of Iowa as well as city colleges); as well, I've read many articles about such services and have talked to people who have actually been at these places and the impression is that the only reason the young people are there is because it's their desired culture, i.e. not to come to worship so much as to enjoy the music, etc.

#6 I've encountered "mystic" services at both weddings and funerals and it is really weird, and a funeral was pretty close to being occult even in a Christian church. So if I see "mystic journey" my alarm bells go off.

#7. The only time I've ever witnessed "Holy Spirit freestyle" is in charismatic churches and what they are calling the Holy Spirit, isn't. Think Bethel, Benny Hinn, et al.

#8 "God has a wonderful cafeteria plan for your life" is indeed what Joel Osteen is always saying; so perhaps that is why that is satire. I've watched lots of him and his ilk on youtube during reseasrch.

I agree that the most important issue would be adherance to the true Gospel when teaching,

February 5, 2026 at 4:27 PM
Craig said...

2. Again, I'm not willing to suggest that a musical style is completely out of bounds simply because it originated in the RCC hundreds of years ago. It's not my thing, but if it brings someone closer to YHWH, who am I to say no?

3. My point exactly. Small sample size, limited experience, and assuming that it is impossible to stay True to The Gospel simply because of the name. Again, not my thing, but I'd want to explore the specific event in question before passing judgement.

4. Yet your inability to see that, based on your opinion, isn't grounds to automatically dismiss a musical genre's value to others. That you found one song that you personally don't think should be played in one venue, isn't justification for denying someone else the ability to do so.

5. See #3.

6. There's a difference between "alarm bells going off" and preemptively declaring that something is completely out of bounds. Again, I'm not endorsing anything, just suggesting that there is room within an orthodox expression of Christianity for many different expressions.

7. See #3.

8. The whole thing is satire, which I appreciate. I'm just not willing to preemptively discard something due to it's label or genre.

As it should be. As long as that is the foundation of whatever is being done, I see no reason to dismiss things because of label or genre. YHWH does seem to be able to use many people, things, and circumstances to accomplish His plans and purposes.

February 6, 2026 at 9:46 AM
Craig said...

In all seriousness, this is clearly intended as satire or sarcasm. The point they are making is valid to some degree as well. Churches who chase trends at the expense of The Gospel have problems. Yet, that doesn't mean that adding one or more things outside of a Gospel focused worship service is automatically bad, nor that those things are irredeemable or beyond the pale. As long as the primary focus is in the proper direction, I don't see anything in scripture that would automatically preclude things that point to YHWH based on genre/style of the problems similar things might have had elsewhere.

I get the joke, and appreciate it, but it's exaggerated for a reason.

February 6, 2026 at 11:03 AM

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