Papist Support for Murder?!?!

I had just read the book, The Anabaptist Story, by William R. Estep and then wrote my article on baptism. Since the book mentioned the Waldenses sect I decided to read a book in my library which I hadn’t read since 2007: History of the Waldenses, by J.A. Wylie.

The Waldenses were essentially the original protestants, long before the Reformation, and they had the New Testament translated into their own language. The commonality with the Anabaptist was that they both read the Bible as written and didn’t add or subtract from it for their beliefs. Both had issues with the papist religion: the Waldenses refused to accept the false teaching of the Mass and the Anabaptists disagreed with infant baptism.

There was nothing in their teachings that I found in these books that could be considered heresy, but the papist church (i.e. the POPE) decided they were heretics and therefore must be destroyed. Both sects had papist armies and leaders persecuting, attacking and murdering them for “heresy.” The papists killed all people of all ages in some of the most heinous ways possible. 

On 8/10/26 the following comment was posted to my article about baptism but I moderated it out and decided to address it in this post. Here is the comment:

John S. Erwin commented on "What About Infant Baptism?"

I know that this is going to send literal chills down Glenn's spine, but I support the persecution of those Anabaptist heretics. My basis for this is Romans 13. The Roman Catholic Church was a government and it had been entrusted with the power of the sword to protect the citizens. If Rome had successfully stomped them out, we would not have many of the cultural problems that exist today, such as the normalization of homosexuality.

First, it didn’t send any chills down my spine, rather just a shake of the head at such blatant ignorance and scripture-twisting. 

Second, the Catholic Church was originally just the entire Christian Church but Constantine made it a virtual part of all government systems, leading the Roman Church into apostasy and heresy.  NOWHERE in the Bible will you find that the church or government has authority to persecute and MURDER those who disagree with the papist church. Murdering people, especially in horrid and heinous ways, proved that the papist church was NOT a Christian church. Murdering people for not accepting infant baptism or the Mass is not protecting anyone. 

Third, in no way could/would Romans 13 refer to the need to murder so-called heretics.

Lastly, being against baptism and the mass would have absolutely NO connection with cultural problems today—that analogy is just plain STUPID!

What About Infant Baptism?

(Blue ink for citations and maroon ink for citations inside the citations.)

I have never accepted infant baptism as legitimate since I could never find it in Scripture and because baptism is symbolic of the new life in Christ. Faith in Jesus is required and an infant doesn’t have that faith. This citation is a perfect description of the problem:

In opposition to the usual arguments for infant baptism the Brethren set forth their position, underscoring the basic insights of Anabaptism. 

First, the nature of baptism rules out the possibility of infant baptism. New Testament baptism requires prior conviction for, and repentance of, sin, and faith in Christ. Baptism is viewed as a symbol of initiation into the church and a sign of the new life which the believer has in Christ. “In other words, baptism is to be administered only after receiving the Holy Spirit; and children, though they are not necessarily condemned, do not have the Holy Spirit.”

Second, baptism is a symbol and not a sacrament. It has no meaning where faith in Christ is absent. 

Third, Christ has set for us an example through his own baptism. 

Fourth, through the Great Commission he has explicitly commanded us to teach and baptize. Fifth, baptism is not analogous to circumcision: 

“As for the matter of circumcision, it is clear that baptism is not the same as the Old Testament act of initiation, but its its replacement. The analogy should not be pushed too far. Summarizing: Baptism is not the expression of a mechanical covenant theory, it requires a certain type of personal standing and a personal relation to God, the Father of Jesus Christ.” (Jan Matthijssen, Bern Disputation, p.32)

William R. Estep, The Anabaptist Story, pg.206-7

Therefore, on the basis of the N.T., baptism must be preceded by repentance; the person being baptized must have reached an age at which he or she would be capable of repentance. Baptism should never be administered without a previous profession of faith. Baptism is also tied in with membership in the church and infants cannot hold church membership. The order required for believer’s baptism (the only proper baptism) according to Scripture: hearing the Word, believing the Word by faith, repentance, then baptism.

Contrary to some teaching (e.g. Roman Catholicism), baptism has no salvific value, rather it is the inward acceptance of the Gospel and placing one’s faith in the work of Christ for salvation. 

Baptism signifies the forgiveness of sins, an inner transformation of mind and heart, and a pledge of a life of discipleship.

 William R. Estep, The Anabaptist Story, pg.202. Citing the teachings of Conrad (Konrad) Grebel.

It would not be confusing to say that Christian baptism is immersion in water in the name of the  Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, and it signifies that the one baptized is identified with, or united with Christ in His death, burial and resurrection.

Earl C. Smith, M.S., D.D., Paul’s Gospel: An Analysis and Exposition of the Major Epistles, pg.102-103

What about “household” baptisms, as in Acts 10 with Cornelius, Acts 16 with Lydia, Acts 16 with the Philippian jailer, Acts 18 with Crispus, and 1 Corinthians 1 with Stephanas? Wouldn’t children be in these households? The Bible says the people being baptized believed the Gospel message—how do infants have that sort of faith? An excellent synopsis of these events and why they don’t include infant baptisms can be found here: Household Baptisms in the New Testament

Finally, in the Didache (“The Teaching of the Twelve Apostles”), chapter 7, we find the following instructions about baptism, which is what the early church taught and believed:

Now concerning baptism. Baptize as follows, when you have rehearsed the aforesaid teaching: Baptize in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, in running water. But if you do not have running water, use whatever is available. And if you cannot do it in cold water, use warm. But if you have neither, pour water on the head three times—in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

The Big Five O

After the Lord arranged a meeting on 1 August 1974, He then led us to the altar two years later.  We have now been blessed with 50 years together as the two became one. Today we celebrate our 50th.

More Odds and Ends

Long, but interesting article about the defense of the Bible being accurate.

Dismantling 9 “Proofs” of Millions of Years.  The 9 “proofs” are not scientific at all.

The Misplaced Identity of Gay Christianity

When “Sound Doctrine” Gets Redefined.

When a “church” has to decide whether to require monogamy for anyone, let alone leaders, then you know it isn’t a church which follows Christ. The PCUSA denomination has been corrupt from the beginning.  More on the topic.

And if you thought the PCUSA couldn’t get any worse, they are now supporting “sex change” surgery for children, let alone adults.

Mysticism in the Church: Is Mysticism Biblical?

Catholic archbishop praises new mosque, ignores ubiquitous gang rapes by Muslim men.

Then we have a Catholic university having a “very tight relationship” with the Council on American Islamic Relations. 

An old article about the New Apostolic Reformation but well worth learning why they are aberrant false teachers.

It’s been a while since I’ve reported on false teacher Beth Moore, so here’s another good article exposing her unbiblical nonsense.

Then we have the worst of charismania—pure blasphemy! Although this ranks up there—a megachurch “pastor” who says opposing abortion and gun control is “satanic.”

Exposing Mormonism's Latest Deception. Beware of their pretense to Christianity.

Another Response to the Pope!

In my article, Thoughts About the Catholic Church, I posted this statement by Pope Leo XIV (and made a short comment about it): 

God does not bless any conflict. Anyone who is a disciple of Christ, the Prince of Peace, is never on the side of those who once wielded the sword and today drop bombs. Military action will not create space for freedom or times of peace, which comes only from the patient promotion of coexistence and dialogue among peoples.

In my “holding” files I just found this post by Robert A. J. Gagnon on Facebook, 4/10/26 at 5:05 PM. His response is much more thorough than mine:

In a new X post today, Leo again appears to be denying even in his Roman Catholic tradition regarding the concept of a "just war." Note Leo's absolute statements: "God does not bless *any* conflict. *Anyone* who is a disciple of Christ is *never* on the side of those" who use military weapons of war. "Peace ... comes *only* from ... dialogue among peoples."

Taking his statements at face value, he apparently believes that after the Japanese attacked us in Pearl Harbor and Hitler declared war on us we should have done nothing; and that Jesus was opposed to us defeating these two evil empires. We should have continued to engage in "dialogue" with Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan while they were committing murder on an unprecedented scale. That is a morally irresponsible verdict on Leo's part.

Jesus did not require the state to be pacifistic. He did not believe that Israel erred every time or even most of the time that it engaged in warfare as reported by his Scriptures (the Conquest, the period of the judges and tribal confederacy, David's reign). "Turn the other cheek" is not a model for the state (obviously), nor is it for internal policing and criminal punishment.

Granted, Jesus did not side with the violent revolutionaries of his day, just as Jeremiah did not side with those wanting to throw off Babylon's yoke in his day, but that is because they both viewed God as using the great empire of their day to punish Israel. Their approach was not a carte blanche rejection of military force in all circumstances.

Leo's level of moral understanding regarding conflict is shocking for someone who is supposed to be a moral leader for 1.5 billion Catholics worldwide.

Do I Read Fiction?

I am a list-maker. I have a list of all the places/houses in which I’ve lived since childhood, all the  trips we’ve taken, all performances I’ve done, all cats we’ve owned, etc, etc, etc. 

When it comes to books I began keeping a list of those I’ve read ever since high school days. That list got lost when I was in the Army. I started a new list in 1975 but with all the moves we’ve made since then, that got lost in the shuffle. So in 2004 I started all over again.

 

One thing I did was look at my list of all the books I used to own before that time and began making a separate list of books read prior to 2004; compiled from memory and book lists; but that list is very incomplete.  Some books I remember because I read them to my children!

So, someone emailed me a question—Do I read for fun, i.e. fiction? Well my pre-2004 list includes a lot of those that I remember from high school, Army, and since then. For all those wondering the same thing, here is that list (I’ve read lots of these to my wife and/or kids). You’ll see that there are some classics. (The “Cat Who” series was specifically read to my wife.)

1984, by George Orwell

A Little Princess, by Frances Hodgson Burnett

A Town Like Alice, by Nevil Shute

Animal Farm, by George Orwell

Atlas Shrugged, by Ayn Rand

Back Home, by Michelle Magorian

The Best Loved Poems of the American People

The Book Thief, by Markus Zusak

Captains Courageous, by Rudyard Kipling

Carry On, Mr. Bowditch, by Jean Lee Latham

Castles in the Sand, by Carolyn A. Greene

The Cat Who Could Read Backwards, 

    by Lilian Jackson Braun

The Cat Who Ate Danish Modern, 

    by Lilian Jackson Braun

The Cat Who Turned On and Off, 

    by Lilian Jackson Braun

The Cat Who Saw Red, 

    by Lilian Jackson Braun.

The Cat Who Played Brahms,    

    by Lilian Jackson Braun

The Cat Who Played Post Office, 

    by Lilian Jackson Braun

The Cat Who Knew Shakespeare, 

    Lilian Jackson Braun

The Cat Who Sniffed Glue, 

    by Lilian Jackson Braun

The Cat Who Went Underground, 

    by Lilian Jackson Braun

The Cat Who Talked to Ghosts, 

    by Lilian Jackson Braun

The Cat Who Lived High, 

    by Lilian Jackson Braun

The Cat Who Knew a Cardinal, 

    by Lilian Jackson Braun

The Cat Who Moved a Mountain, 

    by Lilian Jackson Braun

Catch-22, by Joseph Heller

Charlie and the Chocolate Factory, by Roald Dahl

The Complete Calvin and Hobbes, 3 volumes - twice!

Chronicles of Narnia (7 stories), by C.S. Lewis

The Count of Monte Cristo, by Alexadre Dumas

Three “books” from “The Complete Sherlock Holmes,” 

    by Arthur Conan Doyle

The Darwin Conspiracy, by James Scott Bell

Emma, by Jane Austen

Fahrenheit 451, by Ray Bradbury

The Flames of Rome, by Paul L. Maier

The Four Feathers, by A.E.W. Mason

Grimm’s Complete Fairy Tales

Hamlet, by William Shakespeare

Heidi, by Johanna Spyri

The High and the Mighty, by Ernest K. Gann

Hiroshima, by John Hersey.

The Hobbit, by J. R. R. Tolkien

How Green Was My Valley, by Richard Llewellyn

Huckleberry Finn, by Mark Twain

The Inheritance, by Louisa May Alcott

The Invisible Man, by H.G. Wells

The Island of Dr. Moreau, by H.G. Wells

Les Miserables, by Victor Hugo.

Little Lord Fauntleroy, by Frances Hodgson Burnett

The Maltese Falcon, by Dashiell Hannett

The Man Who Thought He Could Fly, by J.L. Pattison

The Mind Invaders, by Dave Hunt

Mr. Roberts, by Thomas Heggen.

Mrs. Miniver, by Jan Struther

Morning Star, by Marian Wells

Murder on the Orient Express, by Agatha Christi

Northanger Abbey, by Jane Austen

Pilgrim’s Progress, by John Bunyan

Persuasion, by Jane Austin

Pollyanna, by Eleanor H. Porter

Pontius Pilate, by Paul L. Maier

Pride and Prejudice, by Jane Austen

The Princess Bride, by William Goldman

The Railway Children, by E. Nesbit

Sanctuary of the Chosen, by Dave Hunt

Saving Kennedy, by Jerry L. Pattison [Time travel]

The Screwtape Letters, by C.S. Lewis

Sense and Sensibility, by Jane Austen

This Perfect Day, by Ira Levin.

The Time Machine, by H.G. Wells

To Kill A Mockingbird, by Harper Lee

Tom Sawyer, by Mark Twain

The Wall, by John Hersey (in high school)

The War Lover, by John Hersey

Les Miserables, by Victor Hugo

Uncle Tom’s Cabin, by Harriet Beecher Stowe

The Wall, by John Hersey

The War of the Worlds, by H.G. Wells

Wuthering Heights, by Emily Bronte