We who preach the gospel must not think of ourselves as public relations agents sent to establish good will between Christ and the world. We must not imagine ourselves commissioned to make Christ acceptable to big business, the press, the world of sports or modern education. We are not diplomats but prophets, and our message is not a compromise but an ultimatum. A.W. Tozer
Therefore let God-inspired Scripture decide between us; and on whichever side be found doctrines in harmony with the word of God, in favor of that side will be cast the vote of truth. --Basil of Caesarea
Once you learn to discern, there's no going back. You will begin to spot the lie everywhere it appears.

I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who has strengthened me, because He considered me faithful, putting me into service. 1 Timothy 1:12

Friday, June 8, 2018

Timothy Keller Is WRONG!

First, we use only professional and/or trained musicians for our worship services, and we pay them all. … Second, we often include no-Christian musicians in our services who have wonderful gifts and talent. … When we invite non-Christians to use their talents in corporate worship, we are simply calling them, along with every other creature, to bring their “peculiar honors” and gifts to praise their Creator.

Timothy Keller, “Reformed Worship in the Global City,” in D.A. Carson, editor, Worship By the Book, pg.238-239.  Cited by Gary E. Gilley, “The New Calvinism,” The Quarterly Journal of Personal Freedom Outreach, Vol.38/No.3, pg.11

Why is he paying musicians — shouldn’t these be members of the congregation giving their talents to the Lord in their worship? With paid musicians you have a concert, not worship.

Has Keller not read 2 Corinthians 6:14? How can non-Christians lead worship if they do not even know God?  And what if they are worshipping an idol? Where does he find in Scripture the people of God inviting pagans to lead them in worship?!

And yet pastors across the nation praise Keller as a teacher, and bring his books, etc into their assemblies for “Adult Education.”  (Remember, Keller is also a theistic evolutionist - a heresy.)


Martha said...

Nope. Young earth creationism is just as wrong as the flat earth theory or the idea that the earth is the center of the universe.

Glenn E. Chatfield said...


Have you ever really studied the issue? Young Earth IS the biblical teaching. Old earth is the evolutionist teaching, of which there is absolutely no scientific evidence. All evidence points to young earth.

Anonymous said...

Theologically, only young earth makes sense.

There's a lot of Scriptures one could reference, and I'm sure Glenn could piece together quite a defense from the Word (which Glenn, I bet you already have somewhere on this blog!), but one of the simplest quick answers is this: Scripture says plainly, there was no death before sin (Romans 5:12). None. That means, no dead animals, no dead anything, until Adam and Eve sinned. So all those dinosaur fossils? After Adam and Eve.

And yes, as Glenn said, the scientific evidence confirms a young earth. But the true defense is that the Word teaches a young earth.


Martha said...

We share the same name here Martha! This Martha believes in the young earth as prescribed through God's Word. Much of the scientific industrial complex uses methods based on "theory" such as carbon dating. Since scientists do not know, or will ever truly know the exact age of an object, they have devised theories in molecular structures, calling them facts.

Tis a sad, sad day when we cannot admit that our LORD is all powerful, Sovereign, and all knowing....man still desires to be god in place of the Biblical GOD.

And I'm so incredibly thankful that He is in control of all weather as well.....mankind loves its pride.


Glenn E. Chatfield said...

The whole "Old Earth" philosophy relies on evolutionism, for which no scientific evidence exists. (C14, by the way, is usually a pretty good indicator of age, but it is limited to only about 5,000 years -- too many think it gives older dates.)

What Evolutionism really is, is a philosophy based on speculations, assumptions, and assertions -- just no facts.

Anonymous said...

I'm a gap creationist, and I know that God didn't create the devil! And no, there are NO reputable scientists who affirm this revisionist interpretation of scientific data. The Bible tells us also to examine nature (Psalms 19:1-3; Romans 1:20). OF OLD God has created the earth (Psalm 102:25). Genesis tells us that God created everything in a week; science tells us that such was accomplished millions of years ago.

Glenn E. Chatfield said...


The "Gap theory" has been debunked by solid theologians for decades. It doesn't make sense via science or the Bible.

God created all the angels, and satan is an angel.

Try giving me ONE scientifically proven fact about Darwinian evolution -- just one.

Again, God said he created everything in one week of seven 24 hr days. That is exactly what happened.

"Science" so-called invented the idea of millions of years without one iota of factual evidence.

David Brainerd said...

This is one of the arguments the Church of Christ used to use against instrumental music as a slipper slope argument. And of course Baptists said "That will never happen. Just cuz you use instruments in worship doesn't mean you'll end up hiring non-Christians to put on a concert in the service." Looks like a whole denomination needs to eat their words.

Glenn E. Chatfield said...


Sorry, but using instruments for worship does NOT lead to a "slippery slope." The idea as noted in this article has to do with using entertainment to attract people.

The use of instruments in worship is very Biblical.

David Brainerd said...

I don't know of any churches left that had instrumental music that haven't gone to a rock concert model in their worship, so no, it definitely is a slippery slope. Enjoy the slide.

Glenn E. Chatfield said...


Odd, isn't it, that for hundreds of years churches had instruments as part of their worship, but suddenly it is a slippery slope to evil?

It sounds to me as if you may be a member of that cultic Church of Christ. I already proved from Scripture that your ideology is erroneous.

David Brainerd said...

"Odd, isn't it, that for hundreds of years churches had instruments as part of their worship"

That's not even true. It started in the late 1800s.

Glenn E. Chatfield said...

Try a wee bit of research.

In the O.T. we see instruments used in worship, so why would the N.T. Christians suddenly cease to use them? As noted in the article linked to in a previous comment, instruments were used in the N.T. church for worship.

While some sources say the early Catholic Church introduced instruments in the 7th century, others say it wasn't until the 10th or 12th Century, while Thomas Aquinas in the 13th Century said that Romanists didn't use instruments so as not be seen as "Judaizing."

The churches of the Reformation dropped musical instruments because they believed it to be a Roman Catholic invention.

The main point, though, is that NOWHERE in Scripture are instruments proscribed from worship.

David Brainerd said...

Regardless, you can't deny the slippery slope has proven true. Show me a church that has instrumental music that hasn't devolved into a concert. Once you start using instruments, the music that gets written is no longer written to be sung by a congregation but rather to be performed by professional musicians. It only makes logical sense that this would happen! And history proves that it HAS happened! You want to deny reality so you can have your ears tickled. The only way to prevent the "worship" turning into a concert put on by unbelieving professional musicians is to ban instrumental music from church--proven.

Glenn E. Chatfield said...

Give it up, David.
YOU ARE WRONG! You are playing the Church of Christ game.
SOME churches devolve into concerts, not all.

Funny, but a church I attend in my town has a pianist and occasionally a guitar-player, and they are very fundamental in their teachings and will never go "concert." I know of many churches who decry the whole concert-atmosphere ideology and yet have pianos or organs in their worship time.

You want to paint everyone with a broad brush with your legalistic ideology.

Game over, David.

David Brainerd said...

But they probably have liturgical dance with girls prancing around in ballet outfits.

Glenn E. Chatfield said...


You have now crossed the line into lying, libelous, juvenile attacks. You are hereby banned from this blog.

RogerB said...

I hope this doesn't get deleted because its off topic but please be aware of Timothy Kellers Gospel Coalition which is pushing for the Church to accept LGBT faith based partnerships'!


Glenn E. Chatfield said...


Since the topic here is Tim Keller, you comment is germane. I am collecting information for doing a separate article just on Tim Keller and all his false teachings.