tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6043971967398769903.post3333205490038889774..comments2024-03-27T19:50:47.426-05:00Comments on The Watchman's Bagpipes: Is the “Community of Christ” a Christian Church?Glenn E. Chatfieldhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04117405535707961903noreply@blogger.comBlogger62125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6043971967398769903.post-50249044357103194112016-07-29T11:52:46.615-05:002016-07-29T11:52:46.615-05:00Paul,
A friend of mine, along with his family, we...Paul,<br /><br />A friend of mine, along with his family, were RLDS. He found enough truth there to lead him to the Lord and out of the cult. His family remains, much to his sorrow, because they do not know the real Jesus.<br /><br />God "chooses to bless" those who seek him, and unless people are truly seeking a God not of their own making, they won't find the true God.<br /><br />Renting a religious camp to pagans does seem to be a bit incongruous!<br /><br />I don't consider the Vineyard to be a cult, it's just aberrant with false signs and wonders teachings.<br />Glenn E. Chatfieldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04117405535707961903noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6043971967398769903.post-7896812925243051822016-07-29T09:04:20.410-05:002016-07-29T09:04:20.410-05:00I was an RLDS,even baptized in the faith. I attend...I was an RLDS,even baptized in the faith. I attended a branch in Ridgewood N.J til 1980<br /><br />Ironically most of the members behavior would put a lot of Christians to shame. I do believe despite the doctrinal error,there were members who's hearts were truly seeking God [God isn't restricted on whom he chooses to bless based on beliefs]I really believe there were some real McCoys as members who's only err was their using the DIC.I'm now with The Vineyard also coined a cult by many<br /><br />The Church began to dwindle as most members moved to the Midwest. It's now run by a female pastor with only 5 members that once had over 70<br /><br />There is a camp located in New Hope Pa that is a retreat to all RLDS churches in the northeast. I find it hypocritical that they will rent the campgrounds to Muslims even Buddhists. Ain't that a double standard?.<br /><br />I concur with you that this is a cult.I witnessed to an obstinate member for 5 years,he now renounced the church he was once pastoringPaul Davisonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14474899989650692223noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6043971967398769903.post-83886047107857289722016-01-28T15:07:13.960-06:002016-01-28T15:07:13.960-06:00Anonymous,
The Community of Christ claims that th...Anonymous,<br /><br />The Community of Christ claims that their Doctrine & Covenants are Scripture and are believed to be true. D&C 76 teaches that there are three kingdoms of heaven. <br /><br />The RLDS, as with the LDS, subscribes to belief that Joseph Smith was a prophet of God, meaning that if he stated God told him things, these things were true. Smith claimed God said all Christian churches were corrupt and therefore the Church had to be restored. Ergo, those outside of the true church are corrupt and are unsaved. Either you accept him as your prophet or you don’t — you can’t pick and choose what to believe about Smith’s prophecies and teachings received from God.<br /><br />As for anyone being damned who do not accept Joseph Smith’s teachings (i.e., anyone outside of the RLDS), I suggest you read your D&C 18:2f, 20, 42:16a,b, 76, 83:8-13. <br /><br />As long as you proclaim that Joseph Smith is a prophet of God, that the the Book of Mormon is from God, and that the Doctrines & Covenants are from God, you have to believe and teach what they say. <br /><br />Try reviewing all the above comments so as to not repeat what has been addressed.<br />Glenn E. Chatfieldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04117405535707961903noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6043971967398769903.post-74684613955028620132016-01-28T10:34:19.629-06:002016-01-28T10:34:19.629-06:00Although some of this information is true, some is...Although some of this information is true, some is NOT! Community of Christ does not teach the idea of a Three Kingdom Heaven, that is theology of the the Utah church. Also, Community of Christ does not teach that everyone outside of the church is "damned". The church teaches that while we believe our history and story is indeed inspired by God, that other beliefs are not evil and untrue.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6043971967398769903.post-71816089717750440302014-02-15T22:42:16.237-06:002014-02-15T22:42:16.237-06:00As a lifelong member of the Rlds/ Community of Chr...As a lifelong member of the Rlds/ Community of Christ I must say the author of this blog is correct in his entire account of how non-biblical this movement is. I have been a pastor of two different CofChrist congregations and begun a sincere study of my faith community. I must say the institutional church was founded under a false occult prophet Joseph Smith and it's teachings about salvation are false. I had hopes that when the church finally admitted Smith was a polygamist that the movement would de-canonize the Book of Mormon and the Docterine and Covenants. I soon realized the church needed the "modern revelation" to advance its pluralistic apostate theology. My children have seen the light and have left the church and their father and mother are soon to follow. For those who remain in a dead church I will pray for you to see the light!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6043971967398769903.post-35210033186359558452013-12-17T02:00:43.452-06:002013-12-17T02:00:43.452-06:00The Bible says that God is not the author of confu...The Bible says that God is not the author of confusion. If you just take a look at the CoC website as it currently reads, regarding their faith it is really quite unintelligible. The information presented is also ever changing, constantly revising and updating their believes to fit with the "times". God does not change however. God is the same today as he was in the beginning of the earth. Why then would CoC have to keep changing the word of God (as they claim the Doctrine in Covenents to be) as if the God of today has had a change of mind or is indecisive? Just thoughts to ponder. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6043971967398769903.post-63019773679759425742013-12-04T08:59:01.123-06:002013-12-04T08:59:01.123-06:00Hello Anonymous,
You wrote, ”No one has the right...Hello Anonymous,<br /><br />You wrote, <i>”No one has the right to say that the Community of Christ is not a Christian church.”</i><br /><br />Well, you are in error, because every Christian has the right to compare teachings with Scripture and then declare if the teachings aline with Scripture. If the teachings don’t align with Scripture, the it isn’t Christian.<br /><br />I’m not addressing the beliefs of individuals in this blog article, rather I am address the teachings of the Community of Christ denomination. I examined their history, their acceptance of the false prophet Joseph Smith, and all the other false teaching of the Community of Christ (RLDS). <br /><br />I have a good friend who came out of the RLDS, but whose family are still members. As with Roman Catholicism, there are those who may become real Christians in spite of the teachings of the church they attend, as I noted in the next-to-last paragraph in my article.<br /><br />If you would read the comment string, you would also notice that “Mark” is an ex-RLDS who agrees with me. Also, “Kevin” challenges me with a string to which I respond, and you might find that of value, especially since I cite RLDS material. And if you continue in the comment string, you will see more defense of the RLDS and my rebuttals, and these just might possibly answer questions you may have.<br /><br />I challenge you to demonstrate what I have posted which isn’t factual informationGlenn E. Chatfieldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04117405535707961903noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6043971967398769903.post-22919633208491387902013-12-04T00:33:44.215-06:002013-12-04T00:33:44.215-06:00No one has the right to say that the Community of ...No one has the right to say that the Community of Christ is not a Christian church. My whole family has been brought up in this church, and I am currently a member. I believe that Jesus Christ is the Lord and Savior of this Earth, and I have accepted Christ into my heart. I am a Christian, and I am a member of this wonderful church. You shouldn't post so-called facts unless you know the absolute truth. No matter where you found the information, you should discover this church for yourself before you can say if it is a Christian church or not.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6043971967398769903.post-76577105869649933332012-10-02T19:38:18.714-05:002012-10-02T19:38:18.714-05:00Gretchlby,
The history of the RLDS church is found...Gretchlby,<br />The history of the RLDS church is founded on a false prophet and a false book by that false prophet. Your belief that Jesus came to America is base on a lie - the Book of Mormon. Believing something doesn’t make it true. The Bible would have told us if he went to America. The “other sheep” he mentioned were the Gentiles - that is the context of the passage. And everything Smith put in the mouth of Jesus in the BOM was plagiarized directly from the Bible.<br /><br />I fully understand the history of the RLDS, which is part of this post. The RLDS are not nearly as heretical and aberrational as the LDS. (I am an ex-LDS member)<br /><br />Whether you personally believe in the true Trinity (rather than the three gods taught by Joseph Smith) is not the subject of my post. My post has to do with the official doctrine of the RLDS, much from their own site and publications.<br /><br />You state that my blog was wasted time, but you gave no evidence as to your reasoning. You claim you teach tolerance and yet you are very intolerant of my article.<br /><br />Scripture teaches that we are NOT to be tolerant of false teachings and false prophets, which is why I wrote the article - to expose the false prophet and false teachings of the RLDS. I don’t need to attend a sermon of a false church to be able to understand their teachings - and I have a good friend who has told me much about his life in the RLDS prior to coming to saving faith in the true Jesus of the Bible. That and my thorough research tells me all I need to know.<br /><br />I am sorry you are deceived into believing the lies of Joseph Smith. Perhaps you should look at my article exposing his false prophecies and some of the many problems with the Book of Mormon, and then consider if that is what you want to trust your eternity to.Glenn E. Chatfieldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04117405535707961903noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6043971967398769903.post-27042621589584079442012-10-02T17:56:23.700-05:002012-10-02T17:56:23.700-05:00Wow I was raised in the RLDS religion. I hold dea...Wow I was raised in the RLDS religion. I hold dear the history of the church and the meaning it has had on my family. RLDS members (my three uncles and an aunt are ministers are Christians). We believe in a holy trinity. We believe in Jesus...we just believe that he came to ancient America...why only come to minister to those in the holy land? We stayed east the Mormons went west. Your blog on this was wasted time. You should go to a sermon. You might learn we aren't much different than you...and our services preach the same thing, except tolerance...we teach tolerance.gretchelbyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06001953419035381167noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6043971967398769903.post-71854545812716067822012-05-18T09:05:31.273-05:002012-05-18T09:05:31.273-05:00Emma,
My ministry is not one of “Vain Discussion,...Emma, <br />My ministry is not one of “Vain Discussion,” rather it is a ministry defending THE faith and exposing false teachers and false belief systems so as to help people leave these systems and to help prevent people from being deceived. Jude 3 tells us to earnestly contend for our faith, and many times in Scripture we are called to expose the “fruitless deeds of darkness.” I am but one of many “watchmen” on the wall. It was a “watchman” on the wall who exposed the LDS to me in 1972, leading me to leave the LDS church and eventually coming to saving faith in the true Jesus Christ.Glenn E. Chatfieldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04117405535707961903noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6043971967398769903.post-28106588368033400212012-05-18T03:18:54.557-05:002012-05-18T03:18:54.557-05:00No organisation will stand without Bylaws. I know ...No organisation will stand without Bylaws. I know your interest in the Community of Christ; it is because you have found in A TRUE church of Jesus-Christ. Even Luc did not accept the ministry of PAUL up intill latter. What a prophetic church! Deep message and stong mission in the world. The brothe to Jesus did not accept him and mocked him. Even John doubted of the man he baptized, he sent disciples to inquire. You know the answer? Go and and tell what you have seen and heard. People couldn't believe Mary and Joseph's son be the ONE talked of from ages. I encourage your ministry but the great ministry is to bring people to Christ rather than the Ministry of Vain Discussion.EMMA-PERSPECTIVEShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04489241291154351075noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6043971967398769903.post-62018333571398705872012-05-17T17:32:24.149-05:002012-05-17T17:32:24.149-05:00Anonymous 5/17 5:01 PM
Roman Catholicism was not t...Anonymous 5/17 5:01 PM<br />Roman Catholicism was not the original church, but was a corruption of the Christian church - and it still is a corruption of true Christianity. Dividing off of Roman Catholicism is not what makes a sect a cult. As noted in a comment by me dated 10/23/11, cultism has been defined by Walter Martin:<br /> <i>By cultism we mean the adherence to major doctrines which are pointedly contradictory to orthodox Christianity, yet which claim the distinction of either tracing their origin to orthodox sources or of being in essential harmony with those sources. Cultism, in short, is any major deviation from orthodox Christianity relative to the cardinal doctrines of the Christian faith. A cult, then, is a group of people polarized around someone’s interpretation of the Bible and is characterized by major deviations from orthodox Christianity relative to the cardinal doctrines of the Christian faith, particularly the fact that God became man in Jesus Christ.</i><br /><br />The RLDS fits this description to a “T.” It is not a “Christ centered” church in that the Christ preached by the RLDS is not the Christ of the Bible, nor is the gospel of the RLDS the same one from the Bible. As I noted in the main article, there actually is enough truth hidden among the tares that someone can come to salvation in spite of teh RLDS doctrines. Presenting a “Jesus” who is just about good works and not repentance is not presenting the biblical Jesus. Presenting a “Jesus” based on the teachings of Joseph Smith is not the biblical Jesus. Presenting a “Jesus” from the Book of Mormon is not the biblical Jesus.<br /><br />You say you don’t care about Joseph Smith, yet your church’s foundation is Joseph Smith and the BOM and D&C, which are fraudulent writings. No God did not write the Bible, but he did “breathe” it (2 Tim. 3:16), and the men who wrote it were “carried along by the Holy Spirit” as they wrote what God wanted them to write (2 Pet. 1:21). Your understanding of the origin of the Canon is lacking - I suggest you actually study the facts surrounding canonization. Anyone who alters it is doing so presumptuously and is condemned by Scripture.<br /><br />Jesus corrected misinterpretations of Moses’ writings - he didn’t change a word. Again, you don’t understand what Scripture says. Then again, anyone in the RLDS who actually understood what the Bible says would leave the RLDS!<br /><br />The RLDS is NOT an orthodox Christian faith, and salvation will not be found in it except by accident.Glenn E. Chatfieldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04117405535707961903noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6043971967398769903.post-31909044616972708992012-05-17T17:01:54.795-05:002012-05-17T17:01:54.795-05:00I have learned and visited of the Sites of the wha...I have learned and visited of the Sites of the what I calls Saints. Mind as you talk of the Community of Christ. What is a cult and what is not a cult? They are all cults as they split from the original group but within itself there is nothing to refer to as a cult. Any group that came from the main Catholic branch is for the Roman Catholic a CULT. The Community of Christ is a Christ centered church aimed at "Proclaiming Jesus-Christ and promote community of joy,love, hope and peace. Tell me guy, what you we do that does not present Jesus. We do respect the direction the church takes for sake of salvation. We don't care Joseph Smith Jr; he served and God knows what because he is the only one to render judgement over the work of each one of us. Get in mind that God did not write the Bible, instead the Bible a collection of individuals'encounter with god passed through men's approval. The canon is however conventionally based foundamental human analysis; o nobody can claim its ownership. We alter it every day though we don't write it down, but we let people be directed by our commentary during sermons. At times state wrongly without knowing. Even Jesus in his time fixed what he judged fair though it stood away from what Moses affirmed. CofChrist brings an excellent ministry of salvation, so don't mislead people. That is not Good News. <br />WE ARE A CHRISTIAN CHURCH AND FULL CHRISTIAN CHUCH RESPONDING TO THE MISSION OF JESUS. We have no secracy in our ministry, come to experience the Spirit of truth. To be honest, you should published this or your blog is on bad intent.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6043971967398769903.post-12802712867394573912012-05-17T14:03:00.183-05:002012-05-17T14:03:00.183-05:00The National Council of Churches is a liberal orga...The National Council of Churches is a liberal organization. They don't seem to be bothered by doctrine. Truth isn't their strong suit.Glenn E. Chatfieldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04117405535707961903noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6043971967398769903.post-32097975843467142582012-05-17T12:55:23.826-05:002012-05-17T12:55:23.826-05:00Is the National Council of Churches Christian?
Af...Is the National Council of Churches Christian?<br /><br />After extensive study, they have admitted Community of Christ to full membership. Having a well-known, well-respected ecumenical Christian body accept CoChrist as a member suggests that they think CofChrist is Christian.<br /><br />And if anyone thinks that National Council of Churches is not Christian, that says something pretty significant about their definition of Christianity.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6043971967398769903.post-12604348832600246782012-05-17T11:22:16.889-05:002012-05-17T11:22:16.889-05:00Anonymous 5/17,
I know the RLDS believes in “conti...Anonymous 5/17,<br />I know the RLDS believes in “continuing revelation,” which is part of what makes them a cult. Anyone can claim they got a revelation from God and no one compares it to Scripture to determine its veracity. All the revelations, from Joseph Smith, Jr to the most recent are all fraudulent, since the contradict the Bible. Then if new “revelations” contradict old ones, the new ones are to be accepted over the old ones - as if God is fickle and just has to keep changing his mind! You can’t say Joseph Smith, Jr was a prophet of God, whose BOM, D&C and POGP all came from God through him, and then turn around and say God was wrong back then and is right now!! This is intellectual schizophrenia and just plain illogical!<br /><br />Your claims about what the Bible says is straight out of the atheists’ playbook. It seems this is a common denominator from RLDS members commenting here, which demonstrates you lack of biblical literacy. These claims have been answered hundreds of times over the years, and yet you pretend there is good explanation. Just to demonstrate:<br />The issue of clothing was a law for the nation of Israel only - and no one else. So why do Christians need to consider it?<br />The slavery mentioned in the Bible was a different institution than what we are familiar with today; however, slavery was never condoned in the N.T.! Accepting that an institution exists does not condone it. <br />War may or may not be proper for Christians, but one thing we are told to do is to obey the laws of the land, and if the laws of the land say you must serve in the military and go to war, then one must obey. Jesus never condemned the Roman soldiers for being such.<br /><br />No one claimed that Biblical prophets spoke for God every time they said something. But Joseph Smith, Jr.’s claim was that what he speaks IS of God, and all of his prophecies (all of which failed) were claimed to be from God. Not only that, but in D&C 21 “God” says the church is to "give heed unto all his words and commandments", that these are to be received as if from God's own mouth, and that the words are given to him through the Comforter. By Biblical standards Joseph could make no mistake of prophecy or as a seer because he is supposedly provided with what to say directly from God. So how can modern revelation change anything Joseph “revealed”?!? <br /><br />Your 2 extra books of “Scripture” have a fraudulent origin, and are total fakes. As long as you accept them and their author as from God, your belief is not Christian.Glenn E. Chatfieldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04117405535707961903noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6043971967398769903.post-56957088521889487332012-05-17T00:03:16.326-05:002012-05-17T00:03:16.326-05:00I'm another Community of Christ member who thi...I'm another Community of Christ member who thinks that we are Christian and are not a cult.<br /><br />I'm not going to rehash the points that have been made repeatedly, but here are a few points that I haven't noticed.<br /><br />1. We believe in continuing revelation. That is, we believe that God speaks to people throughout the ages just like in Bible times. We do consider Joseph Smith Jr a prophet, but we give the same status to Joseph Smith III, Fred M Smith, Israel A Smith, W Wallace Smith, Wallace B Smith, Grant McMurray, and Stephen M Veazey. And we believe that all of them are fallible human beings. They speak for God... but they also speak for themselves. Sometimes they make mistakes. It is the responsibility of each of us for ourselves, and of the current prophet and our World Conference for the church as a whole, to judge what was prophetic and what was human in each prophet's work. Practically speaking, this means that if something Steve Veazey or one of the other more recent prophets wrote contradicts something that Joseph Smith Jr said, it's the more recent prophet's writing that is the most definitive description of the church's belief. In other words, you'll do better to look at Doctrine and Covenants sections 150-164 or so to get an understanding of what we believe, than to look at Joseph Smith's writings.<br /><br />Another point: you said that if it's in our scriptures and hasn't been removed, it must be part of our teaching. I'm just curious: does that apply to the Bible as well? Is it Christian to forbid wearing of clothing made of more than one fiber such as cotton-polyester blend? Is it Christian to keep slaves? Is it Christian go to war and kill enemy armies? Personally, I don't think so. I think that those were some of the human teachings that made it into the Bible because the Biblical prophets were also human. They didn't speak for God all the time. And most Christians know intuitively which Biblical teachings to ignore. We do the same thing; we just have two extra books of scripture to do it with.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6043971967398769903.post-3383599679949994952012-05-16T20:05:01.364-05:002012-05-16T20:05:01.364-05:00Leigh Anne,
The definition of “Christian” must in...Leigh Anne, <br />The definition of “Christian” must include non-negotiable doctrines. Otherwise everyone can claim the title, which is why we have so many cults. <br /><br />Your claim that Christianity follows man-made creeds is disingenuous as it doesn’t really explain that those creeds were nothing more than solid clarification of biblical doctrines, and were made to separate out the heretics. Your condemnation of Paul is typical of those who follow a false Christ. Paul got his teachings directly from Christ and all of his teachings agree with Christ.<br /><br />Your soundbites about the Crusades and Nazis are straight out of the atheist’s playbook. I suggest you do more research before making such foolish statements.<br /><br />As for Luther and Calvin, they don’t - and never did - define the Christian faith. The Bible defines it.<br /><br />Separating out theology - solid doctrine- is impossible because if you don’t have the God of the Bible, don’t have the Jesus of the Bible, and don’t have the Gospel of the Bible, then all the love in the world will not keep you from hell. A counterfeit God, counterfeit Christ and counterfeit gospel all add up to counterfeit salvation.<br /><br />I never suggested one only talk about Jesus rather than also acting on it, so you just raised a straw man. I don’t know any Christian who would accept that. But you need solid doctrine first or you have a counterfeit salvation. If you love your enemy and feed him and clothe him and yet don’t give him the gospel, you just sent him to hell well clothed and well fed.<br /><br />I did not deny one must live a Christian life in order to be a good witness when preaching repentance, so you again raised a straw man.Glenn E. Chatfieldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04117405535707961903noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6043971967398769903.post-89422407571048435312012-05-16T19:54:58.208-05:002012-05-16T19:54:58.208-05:00Anonymous 5/16/1:32 PM,
I’m assuming you are the s...Anonymous 5/16/1:32 PM,<br />I’m assuming you are the same as the previous five anonymous. I’m only posting your second comment because the first one wasn’t germane to the article and was only a “cheering section shout.”<br /><br />Anonymous 5/16/ 4:11 PM<br />You may also be the same one, but I am addressing this claim.<br />I have never in the article or comments told anyone what they believe personally. I have written what the doctrines and teachings of the church are. Whether anyone personally believes or accepts all the teachings is irrelevant to my article. There are many LDS Mormons who do not believe or accept all the LDS doctrines and teachings; there are Catholics who do not believe or accept all the Romanist teachings. None of this affects what the doctrines actually are!<br /><br />I have a very good friend who was raised in the RLDS and whose family is still a part of it, so I have a good connection, let alone books I have cited in my article as well as the official web site of the RLDS. <br /><br />If you are not willing to accept all the beliefs of the RLDS, then why defend that church and why remain a member? How can you deny the BOM as coming from God and still claim to be a member of a church whose very foundation is on that book and its author? That is illogical, inconsistent and intellectually schizophrenic.<br /><br />No where in my article or comments will you find me claiming a conspiracy or that the RLDS has secrets, so that is a straw man attack. The teachings of the RLDS did not come from Christ; they came from Joseph Smith.Glenn E. Chatfieldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04117405535707961903noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6043971967398769903.post-61837081571349310792012-05-16T16:11:43.133-05:002012-05-16T16:11:43.133-05:00Glenn E. Chatfield You have lifetime members of th...Glenn E. Chatfield You have lifetime members of the church explaining the beliefs of the church to you, and yet you still want to try to tell _us_ what we supposedly belief and that we're wrong. If you had true intellectual curiosity and objectivity about this subject, you'd listen to people who know more about the subject that you do.<br /><br />The beliefs that are posted on the CoC website are the "generally accepted" beliefs of the church. Are you required to accept them all exactly as written to be a member? No. Are you required to accept anything _more_ than that to be a member? No! Do I accept the Book of Mormon as a historical document? No. Am I still a member of the Community of Christ? Yes.<br /><br />You seem to think there's some big conspiracy here... that people are trying hide the history of the church or the beliefs of the church. Again, we have no secrets. There's a wide variety of belief in our church but it always leads back to being followers of Jesus' teachings.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6043971967398769903.post-79885746830869681922012-05-16T15:22:35.223-05:002012-05-16T15:22:35.223-05:00Anonymous:
Response to fifth/last comment:
You wan...Anonymous:<br />Response to fifth/last comment:<br />You want to make a distinction between “Christian” and “disciple of Jesus,” but that is a false distinction. A Christian IS a disciple of Jesus - that is the definition. <br /><br />REsponse: Actually, the definition of a disciple of Jesus is one who follows Jesus as Lord and Master...and no one else.<br /><br />Christianity on the other hand often follows a whole host of man-made creeds, man-made traditions, The "Apostle Paul" quite often is cited far more often by Christians than Jesus himself. <br /><br />"Christians" have killed in the crusades, as Christian Nazi's they killed people in the prison camps. Martin Luther promoted the burning of convents, John Calvin thought Servetus worthy of death for not believing in the Trinity. NONE of these famous "Christians" could truly be considered disciples of the one who called us to love our enemy. <br /><br /><br /><br /><br />You want to separate out theology, but theology is PRIMARY and defines the true Christian faith. The teachings of Jesus include theology/doctrine.<br /><br />Response: Yes, I DO want to separate out theology...because it is NOT primary for a disciple....defining the personage of God in whatever form is not above the call to love. It is only primary to a "Christian" who places theology above love.<br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br />Compassion to one’s enemy MUST include the gospel. You can’t really love anyone if you do not tell them of their need for a savior. We are only commanded to bring more followers into the Christian faith and THAT is how we build the Kingdom of God.<br /><br /><br />Response: I suggest you read your scriptures a bit more thoroughly. If all you ever do is talk ABOUT Jesus instead of living LIKE Jesus it is like promoting basketball without ever playing the game yourself...pretty useless.<br /><br /><br /><br /> <br /><br />While you are correct that many Christians just sit in the pews and don’t concern themselves with evangelism, those people do not define the Christian faith. That “humble rabbi” preached repentance from sin - not just love.<br /><br /><br />Response The best way to preach repentance is to live repentance. Perfect your own life FIRST!!! and let it be a showcase of love.Leigh Annehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13840853546051827376noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6043971967398769903.post-19859817543041448532012-05-16T12:02:54.252-05:002012-05-16T12:02:54.252-05:00Anonymous:
Response to fifth/last comment:
You wan...Anonymous:<br />Response to fifth/last comment:<br />You want to make a distinction between “Christian” and “disciple of Jesus,” but that is a false distinction. A Christian IS a disciple of Jesus - that is the definition. You want to separate out theology, but theology is PRIMARY and defines the true Christian faith. The teachings of Jesus include theology/doctrine.<br /><br />Compassion to one’s enemy MUST include the gospel. You can’t really love anyone if you do not tell them of their need for a savior. We are only commanded to bring more followers into the Christian faith and THAT is how we build the Kingdom of God.<br /><br />While you are correct that many Christians just sit in the pews and don’t concern themselves with evangelism, those people do not define the Christian faith. That “humble rabbi” preached repentance from sin - not just love.Glenn E. Chatfieldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04117405535707961903noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6043971967398769903.post-28884610624313452912012-05-16T11:56:32.737-05:002012-05-16T11:56:32.737-05:00Anonymous:
Response to third comment:
I never stat...Anonymous:<br />Response to third comment:<br />I never stated or implied that the RLDS puts Smith on the level of Christ. What I do say is that the RLDS considers him a prophet of God, and as such must follow his teachings to be logically consistent with the claim that he is a prophet of God. He either spoke for God or he did not. Since he BOM is still considered Scripture to the RLDS, then they are accepting Smith as a bonafide prophet of God. <br /><br />Response to fourth comment:<br />The RLDS does not specify all doctrines on their site because they want to appear to be an orthodox Christian denomination. The creed of the RLDS is not “all truth,” rather it includes false teachings of false prophet Joseph Smith. Whether all members of the RLDS agree or accept all of the RLDS doctrines isn’t the point. The point of the article is what the OFFICIAL teachings of the RLDS areGlenn E. Chatfieldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04117405535707961903noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6043971967398769903.post-54194460229407500892012-05-16T11:48:19.271-05:002012-05-16T11:48:19.271-05:00Anonymous,
I’m going to assume the last five posts...Anonymous,<br />I’m going to assume the last five posts are all by you. <br />The history I put together is very accurate, taken from many reference sources including the official site of the RLDS.<br /><br />The RLDS doctrines come from their site also, as well as from the writings of Joseph Smith who they claim as a prophet. Unless they have specifically renounced particular teachings of Smith’s (e.g. polygamy, plurality of gods, etc), then it must be assumed they still hold the teachings as true. The RLDS considers the Book of Mormon to be true, as well as their particular collection of Doctrine & Covenants. They also accept Smith’s “translation” of the Bible. Rather than repeat much of what I’ve previously written, I suggest you review my comments to Kevin above, as well as comment to others.<br /><br />No, I am not trying to the in the LDS belief of eternal progression when I say RLDS believe in a “visible” God. The two issues are not related. Defining the form of God SHOULD BE a belief of any Christian denomination - the Bible describes His form as “spirit.” I do not remember where I acquired the information about the RLDS “visible” God and I didn’t make a note, unfortunately. Until I can find a reference to cite, I will delete that from my list.<br /><br />Response to comment 2:<br />I have personal experience talking with members and ex-members of the RLDS who say they were unfamiliar with much of the history and teachings of the church. It is they who have confessed to being “ignorant” - I didn’t make that up. And I never even intimated that the RLDS has the temple ceremonies of the LDS. The trouble is, not too many people are interested in doing the research - as apparently you are also guilty. The history of the Romanist church does indeed define the current church, but you’d have to study Romanism to know that. And the RLDS history does indeed define the RLDS as long as they hold to ANY teachings of Joseph Smith.Glenn E. Chatfieldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04117405535707961903noreply@blogger.com