We who preach the gospel must not think of ourselves as public relations agents sent to establish good will between Christ and the world. We must not imagine ourselves commissioned to make Christ acceptable to big business, the press, the world of sports or modern education. We are not diplomats but prophets, and our message is not a compromise but an ultimatum. A.W. Tozer
Therefore let God-inspired Scripture decide between us; and on whichever side be found doctrines in harmony with the word of God, in favor of that side will be cast the vote of truth. --Basil of Caesarea
Once you learn to discern, there's no going back. You will begin to spot the lie everywhere it appears.

I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who has strengthened me, because He considered me faithful, putting me into service. 1 Timothy 1:12

Sunday, January 8, 2012

Random Things in the Christian Realm

There seems to be no end of books from Christians who claim to have visited heaven, visited hell, or had communication with the dead.  The latest book is Have Heart, in which the author claims communication with the dead.  Now, we know necromancy is condemned in Scripture, so I would have to say that pretty well sums up the evidence that this didn’t take place.  This week the blog Herescope had a two-part series, with a third part upcoming, reviewing this book and the ideology behind it.  Go here and here for parts one and two.

While Beth Moore has been exposed as a false teacher time and again on this blog and others, John Piper has been slowly descending into apostasy himself, as many apologetics blogs/ministries have been reporting.  Now we have Moore and Piper joining together teaching lectio divina at the Passion 2012 Conference.  Apprising Ministries and the blog Do Not Be Surprised... both give good reports on this false teaching method.  Sola Sisters has a good follow-up about John Piper’s involvement with this teaching.  And finally, Erin has another report about what really went on at Passion 2012, and what the difference is between biblical silence and the mystical silence found there. 

An interesting addition to this combination of Moore and Piper was a video posted by Apprising Ministries where Piper said, “I’m happy to learn from Beth Moore.”  The post is  still there but the video is missing for some reason.  However, that statement alone tells me Piper is not acting as a shepherd when he is happy to learn from someone who is been exposed as a false teacher in many ways - where is his discernment?  I guess it is dying, as his involvement in the lectio divina demonstrates.
Gary Gilley has an excellent two-part article about the social gospel.  His first part is about the history of the movement, including the morphing into things with the Emergent movement and Rick Warren’s PEACE plan, and the devastation it has caused in the Church.  In part two Gilley discusses what the Bible really has to say about the issue.  You should find this series to be very informative.
Finally, we have false prophet Pat Robertson claiming God has been giving him more revelations.  He claims God even told him who the next president of the U.S. will be, but he won’t divulge that information.  The “revelation from God” is typical false prophet nonsense based on things going on in the world which anyone could give similar speculations about.  And “God” gave him a specific revelation about an economic collapse this year. It is sad that so many people give this man the time of day.


EBenz said...

Hi Glenn! Thanks again for the links!

Here is the video that Apprising Ministries was referencing in the post, "John Piper: 'I'm Happy to Learn from Beth Moore:'" http://youtu.be/2GF0VnBRSeQ

Glenn E. Chatfield said...

Thanks Erin. What happened to the video from the post?

EBenz said...

I'm not sure why it temporarily disappeared on the AM post, but it should be back on there now as well.

Michael Burdick said...

I can't speak for the authors mentioned or their books--but I can tell you that, by the grace of God, I was given an undeniable vision of the gates of hell. Later, He told me that He showed me this because I'd been so cavalier with my salvation that He wanted me to know what I'd been saved from.

Those who say "well, that was an experience and therefore subjective" may do so. I, however, know that it was a remarkable example of the intimacy of our relationship He gave me.

There are, indeed, charlatans who make merchandise of us--but there are also genuine followers of Him to whom He has given such blessings---even when they were hellish.

Glenn E. Chatfield said...

I can't speak to subjective experiences, but the stories of the books are very anti- and unbiblical, contradicting what the Scripture tells us. If your story contradicts Scripture, that proves it's fraudulent.

Michael Burdick said...

Do you want to hear the details so you can give me an assessment of it's "biblical validity?"---due to the details, it requires some length to tell even though the actual time and context where short: You, know, one of those "eternity touches time" kind of things.

I think it is "on point" with the string but it will be longer than than the usual post and may lead some to believe the very length is tacit approval of it's telling even if, at the end, you find it. . .ah. . .lacking.

Face it Glenn, the Christian faith is NOT just doctrines and creeds--SOMEWHERE experience DOES MATTER. We may go though the other persons experience with a bibliodoctrional fine tooth comb to make sure it "all adds up", and to this I would gladly submit. There is however the possability that, while God isn't granting "New Revelation" in such experiences, He is granting new Illumination as He deals with individuals in their personal relationship with Him.

It may not even be that such experiences are meant to be shared because they are so intimate they should be kept quiet (I remember at least one example where Jesus said "Don't Tell!)

Be that as it may, I'd me both willing to share and curious to see what you would have to say about the vision I had.

Glenn E. Chatfield said...

No need for details here, and as a matter of fact in cleaning out my files today I came across an e-mail from you in 2004 where you discuss it.

My statement was not directed at your experience. It was just a statement that if anyone's experiential vision, etc contradicts Scripture, then it has to be not from God. And these books blatantly contradict Scripture.